Easy Lithium upgrade to help others, then upgrade two.

[G-A-R-Y]

To help others searching,
I've been testing (18 months) the lithium (Roamer 160) fitted under the bonnet initially along with Orion XS B2B instead of the dumb relay, along with any possible issues with VW control panel.

All works well, the hottest the battery got to was 42c (France heat wave 35c) the control panel is always 100%. I also disconnected shunt under bonnet with no issues.

A few weeks ago I had an upgrade, we fitted a dummy battery under the bonnet (the battery connections act as a bus bar for the Orion and make it look original, we fitted a 300Ah (Fogstar) in rear cupboard along with a Victron Multiplus 2000 inverter. This charges the battery at 80 amps.

I also had a second MPPT fitted so I can plug external solar panels in at the rear doors.
The folding solar panels make a lot more that the roof mounted. I have a simple "charge, off, Inverter" control panel, pointless adding Cerbo.
I'll add loads of pictures, work was done by Brento Campers in Plymouth.

 

[DMC]

I went with car Electric (Hamburg, Germany). Their system is not cheap but it does work flawlessly. We have done many extended trips (4 to 5 weeks) and never had to use the EHU. Why VW don’t offer lithium as an option is crazy.

 

[WelshGas]

I went with car Electric (Hamburg, Germany). Their system is not cheap but it does work flawlessly. We have done many extended trips (4 to 5 weeks) and never had to use the EHU. Why VW don’t offer lithium as an option is crazy.

Probably because the majority of their target market don't want it, have no need of it and aren't willing to pay the extra. It would also make the production line more complicated if it was an Option.
Those who do want it will go down the DIY pathway or give their business to a 3rd Party.

 

[Maidment_Ocean]

It’s amazing what people see as an easy upgrade! I am awaiting my new Grand Cali order, my easy upgrade will be to plug a 2kwh battery pack into the external socket. This probably says more about my electrical capability TBH…..
I am usually on hookup, just want to make sure I have enough electric to last the odd night of grid.

 

[RoamingHoming]

This is cool. Is the install coded to work with the OEM control panel? What is the reason for the extra control panel?

I'm interested if there's a feasible DIY route for the Car Electric install.

 

[G-A-R-Y]

You need to do your own research and then choose an installer. The control panel is for the inverter or 240v system, there is no need to drive to Germany to have a lithium battery system fitted.

The same or better equipment is available here too, probably much cheaper as well.

There is no "coding" for the display panel which isn't much good to start with.

 

[RoamingHoming]

You need to do your own research and then choose an installer. The control panel is for the inverter or 240v system, there is no need to drive to Germany to have a lithium battery system fitted.

The same or better equipment is available here too, probably much cheaper as well.

There is no "coding" for the display panel which isn't much good to start with.

Thanks Gary, does the display panel show percentage charge accurately? Would it not need coding to recognise that you've now got 300ah?

 

[G-A-R-Y]

So far it has always displayed 100% with Lithium, it's not or ever has been a good indicator of battery condition anyway. Most lithiums have an inbuilt shunt via bluetooth app.

I had a quick look at the Car Electric install and it looks all wrong to me, I notice they've put a 70amp B2B charger inside a dummy battery despite it's need for a well ventilated location.

Also the small (1600) victron inverter is fitted incorrectly, it should ideally be mounted vertically for better cooling. Mine gets very warm and you can hear fans inside.

Again do your own research, I'm no expert. I've added picture of car electrics install.

 

[RoamingHoming]

Thanks! I've read up on the CE install from the caliblog site, and aside from being an quasi OEM install that's efficient with space have wondered where the "magic" is, that accounts for the price.
Taking into account the batteries used (which seem to be quite expensive in themselves), I wonder if it's the knowhow in relation to the coding for the controll panel and the cost of getting the install approved officially by VW.

I'm tempted by the CE install but not quite ready to hand over the 4500e and the trip to Germany for it to be done.

Thanks for sharing details of your upgrade. Do you mind sharing the rough cost for the install?

 

[G-A-R-Y]

Thanks! I've read up on the CE install from the caliblog site, and aside from being an quasi OEM install that's efficient with space have wondered where the "magic" is, that accounts for the price.
Taking into account the batteries used (which seem to be quite expensive in themselves), I wonder if it's the knowhow in relation to the coding for the controll panel and the cost of getting the install approved officially by VW.

I'm tempted by the CE install but not quite ready to hand over the 4500e and the trip to Germany for it to be done.

Thanks for sharing details of your upgrade. Do you mind sharing the rough cost for the install?

£1200 and more Ah too (300). A bigger inverter as well (2000w) than the 1600w they fit. Plus a current limiting control panel opposed to a cheap switch in an awkward location. There is no mention of this invaluable feature which seems to have been missed.

 

[DMC]

Thanks! I've read up on the CE install from the caliblog site, and aside from being an quasi OEM install that's efficient with space have wondered where the "magic" is, that accounts for the price.
Taking into account the batteries used (which seem to be quite expensive in themselves), I wonder if it's the knowhow in relation to the coding for the controll panel and the cost of getting the install approved officially by VW.

I'm tempted by the CE install but not quite ready to hand over the 4500e and the trip to Germany for it to be done.

Thanks for sharing details of your upgrade. Do you mind sharing the rough cost for the install?

The Car Electric installation is one that VW recognise and accept. This means the vehicle warranty is not affected, the camper control unit reads correctly (re the batteries). Additionally, because the CE work is added to VW’s system software updates are carried our without issues.

 

[scotty.aka.dan]

This is pretty similar to what I'm hoping to do, just in the research stage at the moment. I had seen the battery box that car electric install with the Votronic B2B, but thought the same about cooling etc. Can you explain a bit more about how your dummy battery is set up? what's inside the box? Thanks!

 

[G-A-R-Y]

Battery box is empty and just there for show.
It holds the original battery leads in place And acts as a bus bar, also makes it easier to replace the original battery when I sell the van.
None of the original wiring is touched or altered. Victron multiplus compact is the best because it charges the batteries at 80 amps on hookup and has a current limiting feature, if you're on a French camp site with only 5 amps, you can turn the dial to only draw 5 amps and the inverter will top it up giving you full power to run all your appliances at once.
I don't understand why car electric has removed this invaluable feature from the victron system. Here is a picture of my control panel which just shows zero on the shunt which isn't really a shunt.

 

[DMC]

This is pretty similar to what I'm hoping to do, just in the research stage at the moment. I had seen the battery box that car electric install with the Votronic B2B, but thought the same about cooling etc. Can you explain a bit more about how your dummy battery is set up? what's inside the box? Thanks!

This is worth a read and it explains what is in the battery case.

Car Electric self-sufficient package for the Grand California – conversion to lithium battery

Over the last 12 months we have had the pleasure of testing a number of lithium batteries in the Grand California, starting with a 100Ah battery from Wattstunde

www.grandcali.com