Suspension upgrade T6.1

kenseaton

kenseaton

VIP Member
Messages
54
Location
Nice, France
Vehicle
T6.1 Coast 150
I read a thread recently on upgrading the hard T6.1 suspension… but now I can’t find it, even with search. Any ideas?
The thread covered work by a certain UK firm and I’d like an idea of costs
Thanks to all
 
This thread probably: https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/rough-ride.62825/
UK firm most often mentioned is CRS.
I had the Koni Special active shocks fitted to my T5.1 in 2023 by a local Transporter specialist garage (not CRS). Cost ~ £1500 with new bushes and top mounts.
Van had previously been lowered 40mm on H&R springs and the new shocks made a noticeable improvement to ride quality and control.
 
This thread probably: https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/rough-ride.62825/
UK firm most often mentioned is CRS.
I had the Koni Special active shocks fitted to my T5.1 in 2023 by a local Transporter specialist garage (not CRS). Cost ~ £1500 with new bushes and top mounts.
Van had previously been lowered 40mm on H&R springs and the new shocks made a noticeable improvement to ride quality and control.
Thanks, but not that one. CRS does sound familiar though
 
Had my van done by CRS, absolute game changer especially with the upgraded front and rear anti-roll bars. Running 18s at the moment but I have to admit that I reckon it was better with the 17inch Devonports
 
Whatever dampers they fit, just ask for manufacturers data that details exactly why they are better than standard, what internals the manufacturer has used to make a genuine improvement.

Good luck with that.
 
I went to CRS after getting my Coast & realising the ride was nothing like my previous T6s. They did the things described above, highly recommend, very quick & efficient service there. Much better ride now.
 
I’m no expert but, over the years in my job, I’ve built up a good understanding of how suspension works, That, coupled with endless fiddling with mountain bikes suspension (an order of magnitude more complex than anything you’ll find on a car or van), I’m fairly confident I understand the issues with our vans.



I believe the problem is with the speed of the compression damping.



Our UK roads are atrocious! The vast majority of our bumps are what’s termed “square edge” – there is no slow gentle ramp-up to the top of the bump, instead it’s generally a sharp steep face.

What this does is force the suspension damper to accelerate very quickly or to put it another way, when the wheel hits the square bump it tries to move upwards along its travel extremely quickly.



This is what’s know as High Speed Compression. – The high speed is not vehicle speed but damper speed.

Imagine a bicycle pump with your finger over the end. Compress the pump slowly and you’ll feel force but it will be smooth and relatively easy. Try to compress it as fast as you can and you effectively hit a solid resistance.

This is exactly what’s going on in the damper.



Manufacturers have to design a one-size-fits-all system for average roads. Given that average road is a European road then it’s easy to see how our roads massively skew that average.

There’s no chance of getting an optimum solution.



So what’s required is a damper with a greatly reduced High Speed Compression rating.

This isn’t without it’s problems as the opposite of this is rebound damping which needs to be adjusted accordingly.

Unlike mountain bikes (Hi and Lo speed compression and rebound adjustment) van dampers don’t or rarely come with adjustable settings.

Even if they do/did it’s unlikely it’ll cover what’s required. The point being, without dedicated damping circuits, changing the overall setting affects all aspects of the damper.



The whole point of this is I’ve yet to find any manufacturers data that supports any re-design of the internal valving to reduce damping rates as required.

None of the so called suspension experts to my knowledge have done any proper testing with damper instrumentation to demonstrate one brand is better than stock etc. Perhaps I’m wrong? They just fit some shiny new stuff and tell you it’s better.



An interesting experiment would be to remove the dampers altogether and try it on a bumpy road so see what the delta is?



Spring rates could be lowered but I think this might just shift the problem to pitch and roll.



I find motorways are fine but if I’m just wandering around country roads at relatively low speed then I reduce the tyre pressures. Makes a big difference.
 
I’ve just had Koni Special Active struts (https://www.koniuk.co.uk/product/active/) and CRS springs fitted by CRS. Modest lowering (was previously on Solow Low spec Bilstein) with night and day difference from the Solow and the previous standard compromise-spec setup.

I also have powerflex adjustable bushes and H&R ARBs. It all works beautifully.

For context I have had many different aftermarket suspension setups on my vehicles over the 40 years I’ve been building and modifying cars. There are many reasons to modify suspension from standard (aesthetic, performance, comfort etc) I’d suggest having a good think about what you want before you leap.
 
I’m no expert but, over the years in my job, I’ve built up a good understanding of how suspension works, That, coupled with endless fiddling with mountain bikes suspension (an order of magnitude more complex than anything you’ll find on a car or van), I’m fairly confident I understand the issues with our vans.



I believe the problem is with the speed of the compression damping.



Our UK roads are atrocious! The vast majority of our bumps are what’s termed “square edge” – there is no slow gentle ramp-up to the top of the bump, instead it’s generally a sharp steep face.

What this does is force the suspension damper to accelerate very quickly or to put it another way, when the wheel hits the square bump it tries to move upwards along its travel extremely quickly.



This is what’s know as High Speed Compression. – The high speed is not vehicle speed but damper speed.

Imagine a bicycle pump with your finger over the end. Compress the pump slowly and you’ll feel force but it will be smooth and relatively easy. Try to compress it as fast as you can and you effectively hit a solid resistance.

This is exactly what’s going on in the damper.



Manufacturers have to design a one-size-fits-all system for average roads. Given that average road is a European road then it’s easy to see how our roads massively skew that average.

There’s no chance of getting an optimum solution.



So what’s required is a damper with a greatly reduced High Speed Compression rating.

This isn’t without it’s problems as the opposite of this is rebound damping which needs to be adjusted accordingly.

Unlike mountain bikes (Hi and Lo speed compression and rebound adjustment) van dampers don’t or rarely come with adjustable settings.

Even if they do/did it’s unlikely it’ll cover what’s required. The point being, without dedicated damping circuits, changing the overall setting affects all aspects of the damper.



The whole point of this is I’ve yet to find any manufacturers data that supports any re-design of the internal valving to reduce damping rates as required.

None of the so called suspension experts to my knowledge have done any proper testing with damper instrumentation to demonstrate one brand is better than stock etc. Perhaps I’m wrong? They just fit some shiny new stuff and tell you it’s better.



An interesting experiment would be to remove the dampers altogether and try it on a bumpy road so see what the delta is?



Spring rates could be lowered but I think this might just shift the problem to pitch and roll.



I find motorways are fine but if I’m just wandering around country roads at relatively low speed then I reduce the tyre pressures. Makes a big difference.
Re: data, having attended dealer training at KW in germany and touring the factory there’s a lot that goes into analysing and developing applications for specific vehicles (suspension ‘dynos’ etc as well as road tested vehicles). However, i’d accept the point re: compromises but quality aftermarket suspension partially escapes from the ‘Built to budget’ compromise of standard suspension.
 
Re: data, having attended dealer training at KW in germany and touring the factory there’s a lot that goes into analysing and developing applications for specific vehicles (suspension ‘dynos’ etc as well as road tested vehicles). However, i’d accept the point re: compromises but quality aftermarket suspension partially escapes from the ‘Built to budget’ compromise of standard suspension.
Indeed but my point is, I’ve never found any aftermarket data supporting their reasons for wanting us to buy it!

One thing is certain, you can’t buy a UK spec damper which means they’re designed around the same overall average road as OEM kit.
 
I read a thread recently on upgrading the hard T6.1 suspension… but now I can’t find it, even with search. Any ideas?
The thread covered work by a certain UK firm and I’d like an idea of costs
Thanks to all
Have you tries the search from google instead of using the site's search? Just enter the following text (or some other search words) into the google search:
site:vwcaliforniaclub.com t6.1 suspension upgrade
 
Indeed but my point is, I’ve never found any aftermarket data supporting their reasons for wanting us to buy it!

One thing is certain, you can’t buy a UK spec damper which means they’re designed around the same overall average road as OEM kit.
Does beg the question, what data would you like to see? Much of this is subjective feel at the end of the day.
 
Does beg the question, what data would you like to see? Much of this is subjective feel at the end of the day.
Well Afternarket Suspension.com have produced a damper for the T6.1 for example.

They’ve obviously carried out a full R+D program during which they benchmarked the stock OEM dampers. They tested them with instrumentation, dismantled them and decided the internal valving/shims etc were substandard and could be improved.

They then redesigned the internals , re tested and produced data to demonstrate an improvement etc and then……..

they decided to keep it a big secret and just sell a damper to fit the T6.1.

Alternatively, the internals are identical with a different paint job.

Call me a cynic but until I see hard evidence of a better system I’ll assume it’s just different.
 
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